God's Diamonds In The Ruff Podcast
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God's Diamonds In The Ruff Podcast
#164 S5 EP 38: The True Cost of Following Christ, Karen Bejjani's Story
What does it truly cost to follow Christ in a world fraught with danger and persecution? Join us for a poignant conversation with Karen Bejjani as she recounts the harrowing journey of her mother-in-law, a resolute born-again Christian in Baghdad, Iraq. Despite facing severe persecution for her faith, her bravery left an indelible mark on Karen’s husband, shaping his spiritual journey in profound ways. Through Karen's contrasting experiences growing up in the American Midwest and subsequently traveling to the Middle East, we uncover how diverse trials and backgrounds can deepen our understanding of faith and fear.
Prepare to be inspired by the story of a woman named Miriam, whose steadfast faith in the face of peril illustrates the true essence of following Jesus. We'll reflect on the intrinsic value of knowing God and finding our purpose in Him, even amidst life-threatening circumstances. We also explore how to empower the next generation to be authentic witnesses of Christ in increasingly diverse communities. Gain practical steps for initiating faith conversations, sharing the gospel without judgment, and standing firm against spiritual distractions. Tune in for a transformative discussion on living a life devoted to Christ and becoming a beacon of faith in our daily lives.
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Hello, hello, and welcome back, god's Diamonds in the Rough. We are so glad to be with you one more time. If you don't know who we are, I am Catherine.
Speaker 2:And I am.
Speaker 1:Michael, amen. And so we are excited. Today we have a guest with us and we know our first name is Karenaren, and, but we don't want to mess up last name. We just, both of us, just know we're gonna mess it up. So, karen, will you say hello to everyone before we pray hello, everybody, welcome, excited to be here. Can you say your last name? Yeah, it's Bijani Bijani, bijani, bijani, bijani A Bijani. All right, bijani.
Speaker 3:Bijani.
Speaker 1:Yep See.
Speaker 3:I told y'all I was going to mess it up.
Speaker 1:It's all right. It's all right. So, before we get into the conversation, today y'all, we are going to pray.
Speaker 2:Let's get it, michael heavenly father, our lord and our savior, jesus christ, we come to you once again to say thank you, we think, for your grace, your mercy, your loving, kindness and tender mercy and all the things you do to it for us, even the things we don't see.
Speaker 2:We pray in the name he's rebuking any assignment of the enemy that will be sent back into the pits of hell where it came from. God has said bold enough because he don't understand the language of God. We pray in the name of Jesus that your Holy Spirit would just have its way. In Jesus Christ's holy and master's name, we say thank you and we say amen, amen and amen.
Speaker 1:Amen, amen, hallelujah, amen, amen, hallelujah, amen. All right, so, karen, will you tell? Well, the topic at hand, before she does that Topic at hand today is all about the price that we pay to follow Christ. To follow Christ, and you know my whole personal opinion. I don't believe that really people realize that there is a price to pay, but really there is up until you meet him, because you don't really realize or acknowledge what he's done for you. You know what do you think about that, michael?
Speaker 2:I would definitely agree, because God does things in a way that he keeps you from things that you don't even know about. You know you can be driving along and for some reason you have to take that detour on that road. It's probably because God is protecting you from something that he don't want you to see. So definitely yeah, he protects you from things that you wouldn't even think they can happen to you.
Speaker 1:Amen, amen. And so, miss Karen, she has a story that we have already previously tried to record. I just want you all to know, and it's a powerful one, because the enemy tried to stop what we were doing. But we defy the enemy, we look him in the face because the devil is a liar. Jesus is victorious. So we're going to go forward with this interview anyhow, hallelujah.
Speaker 2:Amen.
Speaker 1:Amen. So, karen, would you do us a favor and tell our diamonds about who you are today?
Speaker 3:Yeah, thanks, michael and Catherine. So I want to share a story, that about a woman who really was a catalyst, who made me think differently about my own Christian faith, and that it's important that we have a faith worth sharing, despite all of what feels like risk.
Speaker 3:And so the story starts really with my mother-in-law, because my mother-in-law lived in Baghdad, iraq, and it's a country or a nation where it's illegal to share your faith in Jesus. It comes at a really high price and that's where, when she became a born again believer in Baghdad, iraq, she began to share her faith with the people around her, even when she could be persecuted and even it was illegal. And so my husband saw her do that when he was a four-year-old boy. And then he went out into the streets of Baghdad, iraq to proclaim and share, proclaim the gospel, like how he heard from his mom, him. And that got him persecuted and tortured as a four-year-old boy for proclaiming the name of Jesus on the streets of Baghdad, iraq and, as he was growing up as a kid, throughout the Middle East and North Africa in nations where they were predominantly of another faith, definitely not Christian, that continued to get them persecuted and tortured for being a Christian in those nations. So, fast forward, he came to the US as an international student in high school and in that process got reverse kind of persecution from Americans here who thought you know that he was not a believer and just made assumptions about who he was and what he was. And so he walked away from the Lord for 20 years and thought well, if God was real, none of that persecution would have happened to me. And then fast forward 20 years later the Lord began to change his heart in dramatic ways, and so now he likes to say I'm serving the God I once denied, loving the people I once hated.
Speaker 3:Now, my own childhood upbringing was very different than my husband's, because I grew up on a farm in the Midwest American heartland, like a time when 93% of Americans said they were Christian, and then everybody I knew was Baptist or Methodist. And so in that process I didn't even know there were people from other faiths or cultures who didn't know Jesus, and so grew up, raised my kids, pursued the American dream, and then I met my future husband, who was who'd grown up in the Middle East and North Africa, and he took me to the Middle East shortly after we were married. And in that process I was so excited Good, christian girl, right, I'm going to go share Jesus with people who don't know him. But the first time I heard the call to prayer with the mosque, it just filled me with great fear. And we were supposed to go into a town to meet a woman who was the only remaining Christian female missionary, in a town where there was like a breeding ground for radical Islamic terrorists. So just think in that day it was kind of like the Gaza Strip that is today. So it was like that, but we weren't going into the city, we were just going to meet her on the outskirts, but our driver took a wrong turn and we ended up in the heart of the city. So I was in the backseat of a taxi with a borrowed black hijab and big glasses and all I could feel was overwhelming stark terror, because all around our car, to the left and the right, were radical extremists with their machine guns and what looked to me like long blue robes and I thought I was going to die there on the street, a long way from home, and no one knew I was there and God seemed very far away. I couldn't even pray.
Speaker 3:Eventually we made it to this missionary's home we're going to call her Miriam and she flung open the door and she took one look at me because I was just crying and overwhelmed with fear and I was a hot mess and she said welcome to God's house in a heavy accent and she handed me tissues and coffee until I could calm down. And she was the only Christian female missionary left in that city. All the rest had left. They'd been persecuted, churches were burned, people had fled, but she remained behind and I thought who does this? She is crazy. So I said to her Miriam, why are you here? This place is wicked, it's evil. I could sense it in my spirit. It's a bad place. Why do you here? This place is wicked, it's evil. I could sense it in my spirit. It's a bad place. Why do you stay? And she said Karen, these people don't know about Jesus. No one has ever told them Jesus is worth it all and I've never met anyone like her.
Speaker 3:And in that process I just peppered her with a million questions. Like Miriam, when you need groceries, what do you do? When you're out in the street at the market and the gunfire starts? And she said oh, karen, I just drop on the ground and I pray until the gunfire stops and the Holy Spirit tells me I can get back up again. And I I said to her were you born like this? How did you get like this? How did you get this kind of faith? I was just in complete wonder, because I'd never met a woman with such strong faith and let alone one that was sharing her faith boldly in a dark place place.
Speaker 3:And what I realized as I asked her these questions is I thought she was a super Christian missionary, but what I found out was she was an everyday believer who had been married, divorced, her husband left her, destitute. She was full of anxiety and fear and wondered if she was doing the right thing, and she's been broken and lived in dark places. But the thing that was different about her, I realized, was she believed following Jesus was worth it all. She knew who God was and she knew who she was in Him and she knew what he called her to do. And I realized that she spent good time in the Bible, studying the Bible and praying and speaking the Lord and abiding with Him. And I thought, as I was flying home from that country, back to my own hometown, I thought, wow, could I ever have a faith like Miriam? Is that even possible? And I began to pray to the Lord Lord, please, could I have a faith like Miriam? Would you give that? To me.
Speaker 3:And that she really was a catalyst who set me on a journey with that dangerous prayer, where the Lord began to shape and change my own as I began to abide in him. I know that's a lot.
Speaker 1:No, it's just, it's just. It's powerful for me, just simply because you know it's powerful for me, just simply because you know I don't believe that people realize that it is a cost to impact this world. It really does cost us something and typically what it costs us is what we don't want to give in the beginning. Amen, until we understand really the call. Like you said, miss Miriam understood who she was and she understood the call that was on her life, and so that makes it makes paying the price like like going and getting a piece of candy. You know, it makes it sweet, it makes it adaptable, it makes it worth it. In your heart, I guess you could say it's powerful, Very, very powerful.
Speaker 1:Michael, you want to start Go ahead, you go ahead.
Speaker 3:I think one of the things I've learned from Miriam through the years is that I used to look at her and I think, wow, look at her and any persecuted Christian. I've met many since then, people from other faith backgrounds who gave up everything to follow Jesus. And the more people like that I met, the more I realized I didn't have that kind of faith, did I believe following Jesus was worth it all. This was worth it all. And now I realize, after a decade later, that the people who have that walk and they're following Jesus like that, I realize he is worth it all. We realize there is way more on the eternal side of things that our culture around us that seems. Where it seems risky and countercultural to share our faith here and we're worried about what people think that's truly the riskiest place to be. But when we know who God is and who we are in Him, that's where we feel security and safety and comes in a much bigger calling, absolutely.
Speaker 2:Wow. I mean I can say so much with the story that you said. I will say this you know one thing if people don't know what I do, I take especially hearing stories like that. I take the names that are being spoke about and I look it up and see what it means biblically and the name Miriam, and get this. You said the protection, the security, the thing that she was the only one there and still doing what God told her to do. And the word Miriam biblically means a form of Mary. Her name means the form of Mary in Hebrew. It also goes further and says it's a Hebrew name meaning the sea of bitterness.
Speaker 2:Okay, if you see somebody that's doing what God says do, and you're afraid of them, that means you're not going to mess with them. I mean, I wouldn't you know. And that's the reason why I think that you know she still had that faith to do it because God had already told her look, you continue to do what I told you to do. I ain't going to let nothing hurt you. And that's what we got to do. We got to continue to do what God said do, because if he told you to do it, he's not going to let nothing hurt you, bother you. So I mean that is a very powerful story because and like you were saying already, you know it does cost to follow Christ it's going to be people that's going to look at you kind of sideways, going to tell you that you shouldn't do that or hey, that's against this law and that law.
Speaker 2:But if God told you to do it, god is above the law. So if he told you to do it, continue to do it. Law. So if he told you to do it, continue to do it. Don't worry about who's looking at you kind of side-eyed or, you know, trying to give you a bad name or bad reputation, because at the end of the day, god gave you your name, god gave you a reputation. So if he gave you a name and your reputation, nobody can do nothing to you, nobody can do nothing to you, mm-hmm, mm-hmm, amen.
Speaker 3:Michael, as you say, that, it makes me think of this verse in Proverbs Proverbs 29, 25, and that is, the fear of man is a snare that whoever trusts in the Lord is kept safe. Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3:And so oftentimes, I think, when we feel anxious or overwhelmed, we've begun to fear the world and we've begun to fear man people around us. We begin to see people are bigger than our God and what we have to realize is God is Elohim, he made everything, he was before time, he always existed and he set the sun in the sky and the stars in the sky. And so, knowing he is Elohim creator and he is our God, when we trust in Him we're kept safe, no matter what His call is on our life in any given time. So what could man do to?
Speaker 1:us Amen, amen. I kind of want to rewind before we go back to where we were. You said that your husband was persecuted and tortured as a four-year-old.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:What did that look like? Have he? Has he ever described what that looked like like?
Speaker 3:yeah, it comes. Yeah, it comes with explicit warnings. But he was um kidnapped and his persecutor took him up to the top of a tall apartment building complex. To the top and hurt him in unimaginable ways as a four-year-old and then took him by his ankles and angled him over the edge of the apartment complex building and said and called him infidel, cather, I'm going to drop you to your death. And then at that point my husband doesn't remember what happened next, but obviously he wasn't dropped, but his captor left him at the top of that building tied up, and my husband eventually made his way. He met a four-year-old, got himself untied and made his way back home but could not articulate, of course, what had happened to him. Right.
Speaker 1:Well, I just asked that question. I'll tell you why I asked that question. I asked that question because so many times people don't get it that when God has put a call on your life and he's asking you to do something for him, him, it doesn't always necessarily make sense. And, oh yeah, for the simple fact that sometimes that price that you pay, it comes at a very.
Speaker 1:It comes very, very, extremely heavy, but you gotta be willing you gotta be willing and obedient so that you might eat the good of the land. Now y'all can tell me if y'all agree with this. When I think about the cost to follow Jesus, would you do? You think it has everything to do with sacrifice?
Speaker 3:I think what I've been learning from the Lord over the last decade is that it comes down to belief. Who do I believe God to be? Is he good, even in the face of what I can look at and think this is horrible? God, why are you doing this to me? God is always looking at things from an eternal perspective. In ways I'm not God, so I can't even process or think like he does, and so ultimately, what I see are all the bad things that have happened in my own life and also in my husband's life. In that moment of our story it looked horrifying and we could not see any redemption in the middle of it. But now we reflect back and we see how God has turned all those things to good for His purpose and His plan in ways we could never have imagined, better than we could ever have imagined. We didn't know how he was going to work those things out for good, and so it comes down to do we trust who God is and that he is good and that he loves us.
Speaker 1:Amen.
Speaker 3:And that sometimes he allows bad things to happen because he sees the bigger picture that we don't know.
Speaker 1:Amen, michael, what's your?
Speaker 2:thought. Amen, michael, what's your thought? I would definitely say sacrifice is, is the key, is one of the keys to the following christ and following after. You know your calling, that he has put on your life, because sacrifice is letting god have his way. So sacrifice is definitely a key, because how can you continue to do what god called you to do if you don't let him operate through you?
Speaker 1:Amen.
Speaker 3:We're picking up our cross and we're following him.
Speaker 1:Hallelujah. So, with everything that you've been through and all that you've learned on this journey, where has it led you? What is ultimately your message? What is God calling you in this season To do?
Speaker 3:You know, it's been a great adventure, because now I see that when you're walking with the Lord, life becomes an incredible adventure with a far bigger purpose than you can ever imagine when you depend on him.
Speaker 3:And so where God has me and my husband, certainly in the season is that the world's least reached people, nations, are now at our doorstep Buddhists, hindus, muslims from the world most unreached places are right here.
Speaker 3:They're our neighbors, like in the school district where we live, there are 79 different languages spoken, so our kids and our grandkids are going to school with the world's least reached nations and the way the culture is today, where it's like I'm okay, you're okay, you do you and I'll do me and anything goes.
Speaker 3:It's important that we are very purposeful as parents, as aunts and uncles and grandparents, that we are passing the baton of faith well to the next generation and empowering them to be witnesses in their daily life, because our kids are going to schools and temples and their best friends are Muslim, hindu, buddhist now, and they're being invited to mosques and to temples, and the fastest growing group of people converting to Islam right now are college-age females, and so it's important that we understand and be aware of the times that we live in and we pass that baton of faith to the next generation of love.
Speaker 3:So, with that said, our ministry has resources for the church that help everyday believers like you and me know just practical ways we can be authentic witnesses in our everyday life, and so lots of free resources on our website you can go to thebluecordorg to get those and we're all about preparing people to be authentic witness, like when you're at the grocery store, the park or, you know, helping your first grader goes through, you know her best friend is muslim, and just being able to have a conversation with your daughter, your granddaughter, about what other people of other faiths and religions believe.
Speaker 1:So there you go, amen. So that was say that website again www.
Speaker 3:Yeah thebluecordorg, like the color blue C-O-R-D cordorg. So that's our women's ministry. But there's a tab up there where you see there's a course called Ethnos. You can start to take that for free and just get equipped so you can be a role model for your family, for your kids and your grandkids and your nieces and your nephews.
Speaker 1:Amen. That's awesome, because that's one thing that we definitely need in our world today is equipping. I don't believe we can ever learn too much in regard to the gospel, because it is so diverse. You would think that it's not, you know, but it is so diverse. You would think that it's not, you know, but it is so much out there, so much, uh, so many cultures and traditions that are out there, you know, for a whole lot of people, it's hard to discern what is true.
Speaker 1:Amen, yeah, and I believe that our only job, our, our job is to point people to the cross and the cross the cross, j Jesus. He does the rest of the work. You know what I mean. We're supposed to point them in the right direction, and the other thing that we're supposed to do is just love them where they are.
Speaker 3:And sometimes what I find is that sometimes the love is not enough because we have to know how to invite people. How do we, how do you, just quickly? When we talk with people from other faiths and cultures, their worldview is dramatically different than our own, and so just a few little things to know. That's not rocket science. If I can do them, anybody can do them. Just to mention that you're a follower of Jesus, initiate prayer in Jesus' name, invite someone to study the Bible with you. You would be shocked at how much people from other faiths and cultures will say yes to that and know how to share the gospel really quick. Not like you think, like where you say this big presentation and expect an answer at the end. But most people from other faiths and cultures around us have no idea what Jesus followers believe. They have no idea amen.
Speaker 1:that's something to think about. And I say it's something to think about because we have a a lot of people who, who, who are not believers or they say they don't follow jesus, and they want to be here in this, on this show, and you know, I still, we are still learning how to, how to have them here without making anybody feel like they're being judged for what they do or what they follow. One of the hardest things we could try to do is remain, uh, remain pointing for, pointing for Jesus, pointing them and directing them to Jesus, and still and without making them feel like, well, you know, they're judging me, and I think that's hard, that's a very hard thing. What do you think, michael?
Speaker 2:I would definitely say so because, um, I think what I'm hearing is right. It's easier said than done to point somebody in the right direction if you don't understand the battles that they're facing. I'll say that again, it's hard to point somebody in the right direction if you don't know what battles they're facing. I mean, that's what I mean by that, is it's a two-way street. You have to understand what somebody's going through. Yeah, to help them see their way through.
Speaker 1:That's true, that's very true. What's your thoughts, ms Karen?
Speaker 3:I think that Satan doesn't want us to share Jesus or shine our light in the world, and so, with that in mind, it keeps us busy doing a lot of things in church or just in life, so that we forget about it and we forget that there are people all around us who don't know Jesus and are desperate to know that there is the hope that can only be found in Jesus. So I want to tell you a story. I just talked to Yvette right before I jumped on with you and she was telling me how she got skilled up. She, she went through that online course I was telling you about and she went into purposefully. She went into, uh, ethnic restaurant. She'd never been outside of her comfort zone and, um, she felt this nudge from the holy spirit to say offer to pray for this guy who was her server, and she'd never done anything like this in her life. And it always thought, oh, you've got to build a big relationship with someone and earn the right to tell them about Jesus after a couple of years, and it's going to be really hard. That's what she thought in her head. But she thought, ok, I'm going to just follow the prompting of the Holy Spirit. So she just said to the guy hey, I know this is going to sound weird and God must really love you because I'm a follower of Jesus and he keeps nudging me to ask you if there's anything I can pray for you about. And then he just looked at her shop and she said do you pray? And he said no, I don't pray. He was in a Hindu restaurant and then she said well, is there something I can pray for you about? And he just like his eyes teared up and he just blurted out I'm an alcoholic and I can't stop. Pray for me for that, wow. Stop Pray for me for that, wow. So she just bowed her head with him right there and she prayed with him and he teared up and she was like thinking to herself, she was just shocked. She'd never done this before. But she went into that restaurant looking for a divine appointment, with intention, with purpose. She felt the prompting of the spirit that said pray for this man, initiate prayer. He embraced that and she was just in a state of shock. So she walked out to her car, she got in her car and then she felt the nudge said go back in. So she's like I can't believe I'm doing this. Anybody who knows me know I would never do this.
Speaker 3:She went to that restaurant and she said to that man who was still waiting there he was still standing there, kind of teared up, and she said the next time you feel like you want to drink, you cry out and pray to Jesus Christ. You know I'm a follower of Jesus and here's what that means. And she quoted Romans 10, 9. And he said thank you so much. Will you come back again? That afternoon she went and she told her family what had happened. Her kids were in middle school and high school and they were like mom, I can't believe you did this. You mean that man right there in the moment told you about his treatment problem. That's crazy, let's go. So they went and had dinner there that night. So now they're in conversation with this man about what, what the god of the bible, the god of creation, is like. So we're just looking for people that god is willing to himself. That's it, and identifying ourselves with j.
Speaker 1:Oh, man, that's powerful. I'm going to tell you why that's powerful, because the Lord just dropped it in my spirit on yesterday, in the midst of giving encouraging words, ushering your faith, ushering your faith. And your friend did just that. Yeah, because she did something she never does, but she did it in faith and she invited the spirit to use her in that moment.
Speaker 1:And I think that we're so full of fear that we don't do that, even those of us that are strong and mighty in the Lord, because there's a part of us that's fearful, we don't move in faith, and we have to learn how to assure our faith in. Wow. Yeah, mic drop, that was a word. Michael, you got anything.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I do. You know, I was just sitting here thinking about something also occurred yesterday and I'll say this first Message received is message achieved. And it's a saying that I heard on a movie that I, you know, I watch is the Substitute, and one of the principles says message received is message achieved. Principle says message received is a message achieved and the message I received yesterday achieved it is um, yesterday I was going on my way to pick somebody up for church and and I got to pass a church to get to his house and you look outside these churches and they got this message board of what the, what the sermon is about. The sign said the sign is broken, the message is inside.
Speaker 1:Ah, I like it.
Speaker 2:And that's letting us know that, look, you can't go by and see the message unless you get into the message. That means you can't receive the message unless you get into the word of God, and I liked it, unless you get into the word of God. And I liked it. That was so profound because many times you know you see these different churches and they had the message board outside. You know you can't go by these different churches and see these different signs and say, oh, I don't want to go in that one, they're talking about me. Oh, I don't want to go in this one, they're talking about me. But at the end of the day, day you got to get into the word of God, whether somebody's talking about you or not?
Speaker 2:because they can be talking about you, but God is talking to you.
Speaker 1:That's my that's my thing, got me messed up there, amen. So, miss Karen, would you do us a favor and give us a final word and pray for our listeners.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I love that word and that reminder to get back into the word, because when we're not, it leaves us weak, need and vulnerable to the lies of the enemy the lies of the enemy, and but when we're in the word, that's where we get strong and victorious for a spiritual battle that maybe we don't even know that's happening around us. So so I'm just going to pray us out. Heavenly father, we just thank you for this opportunity to make much of you. We pray that, through this episode, for each, each one who's listening right now, lord, that they would feel seen, that they would feel known by you, lord, that you would touch each one and give them a next step, a next step.
Speaker 3:Holy Spirit, would you just guide their thoughts and their feelings toward their next step so that they can walk more deeply with you, that you would reveal yourself to them so they know more fully who you are and who they are in you and what you're calling them to do. You have planted each one of us here on this earth, in this generation, at this time, for a purpose, um for the expansion of your kingdom. And we, you call us, each one, to be a bright light right where we live. You're not far from people around us because we're here, and so lord reminded us of that today, and um help each one of us to grow more boldly in our faith and abide in you, so that you're abiding in us and bearing fruit. In Jesus name, I pray.
Speaker 1:Amen, amen, amen, hallelujah. Thank you so much for being here. We appreciate your presence.
Speaker 3:Thank you, thanks for having me. Me have a great day.
Speaker 1:Yes, ma'am, hold on right there. So, diamonds, you heard it. We are so very grateful and so thankful For Miss Karen being here. Thank you for you being here. We hope that you'll come back On next week. Amen, and we share another episode. Amen, so Michael, take it away. Alright, y'all Next week. Amen, and we share another episode. Amen, so Michael, take it away.
Speaker 2:All right, y'all. Y'all know what time it is. Remember until next time. You are a diamond in the rough.
Speaker 1:Amen.
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